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Oil change Intervals - Confusion???? What Oil?


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#41 backlash

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Posted 24 October 2012 - 04:59 PM

I've been using Rotella T-6 in all my bikes for years with good results. My Tiger 1050 came from the factory with Mobil 1 4RT and sticking clutch plates which I pulled and soaked in T-6...problem solved! Less then $20 a gallon at "Wally World!" I can generally tell when my bikes need a oil change do to the gear shifting getting "clunky". Generally around 3500 to 4000 miles after a oil and filter change. That's my take on oil and changes...yours may vary!

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#42 GiL

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Posted 25 October 2012 - 12:22 PM

I bought ten quarts of the Mobil 4T the other day. Enough to keep in stock and for an oil change due on the Multi...
Stumbled onto this thread recently and starting doing some research on that Shell Rotella T6, well I'm returning the mobil and going for the shell...

#43 TurboTiger

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Posted 25 October 2012 - 08:39 PM

Mobil 1 4T is good stuff as well. Especially if it's on sale. Though I hear any oil in the 10w40 range shears pretty badly in a motorcycle. I got the 20w50 so it wouldn't matter much.

#44 fred

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Posted 26 October 2012 - 04:29 AM

I run Mobil 1 in all my bikes. It's readily available at Wal-Mart (best price also). K&N 153 at Amazon.com.

#45 ReidMcT

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Posted 26 October 2012 - 11:42 AM

View PostTurboTiger, on 25 October 2012 - 08:39 PM, said:

I hear any oil in the 10w40 range shears pretty badly in a motorcycle. I got the 20w50 so it wouldn't matter much.


Long ago (so I may be mis-remembering the details) a motor oil chemist - who was lso a motorcyclist - told me that the greater the difference between the low and high numbers in the oil spec, the more "viscocity improvers" must be added to multi-grade oil. VIs are long-chain molecules that do tend to get chopped up by transmission gears. the motorcyclist's goal, therefore, should be to use the narrowest range that meets spec for the intended purpose. If my recollection is correct, then a 20w50 would be just as susceptible to viscocity breakdown as would be a 10w40.

Still, there is a benefit to choosing 20w50 over 10w40: as the viscocity breaks down, the oil reverts toward the lower number (10 or 20 in this case). For most of us, a 20 would be preferable.

For me, a single-weight 40, or a 30w40, would suffice most of the year. But I cannot find a quality brand in those weights.

#46 fred

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Posted 30 October 2012 - 04:45 PM

Yer trying to out engineer the engineers Reid.

#47 ReidMcT

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Posted 31 October 2012 - 06:31 AM

View Postfred, on 30 October 2012 - 04:45 PM, said:

Yer trying to out engineer the engineers Reid.

Huh?

#48 TurboTiger

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Posted 31 October 2012 - 09:55 AM

View PostReidMcT, on 26 October 2012 - 11:42 AM, said:


Long ago (so I may be mis-remembering the details) a motor oil chemist - who was lso a motorcyclist - told me that the greater the difference between the low and high numbers in the oil spec, the more "viscocity improvers" must be added to multi-grade oil. VIs are long-chain molecules that do tend to get chopped up by transmission gears. the motorcyclist's goal, therefore, should be to use the narrowest range that meets spec for the intended purpose. If my recollection is correct, then a 20w50 would be just as susceptible to viscocity breakdown as would be a 10w40.

Still, there is a benefit to choosing 20w50 over 10w40: as the viscocity breaks down, the oil reverts toward the lower number (10 or 20 in this case). For most of us, a 20 would be preferable.

For me, a single-weight 40, or a 30w40, would suffice most of the year. But I cannot find a quality brand in those weights.

The lower number is only the viscosity when cold, which is a different viscosity scaling than when hot. So that means a 10 weight when cold is not the same viscosity as a 10 weight when hot.
Of course the engineers spec'd the oil and expected it to shear down. Hence a 20w50 will probably start out at 50 and shear down to a 40w or possibly a 30w.
What the engineers don't expect is when people start tuning their motorcycles to run rich to get rid of some of the roughness. This can start diluting the oil with fuel, dropping the weight of the oil. Of course the only way to tell is to get a Used Oil Analysis done. $25-$35 at Blackstone Labs. I'll be getting one done at 5.6k miles to see how the oil is holding up.

Edited by TurboTiger, 31 October 2012 - 09:56 AM.


#49 Leo167

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Posted 06 May 2013 - 03:02 PM

Quick question... Does the diavel come with full synthetic from the factory?

#50 GiL

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Posted 06 May 2013 - 03:29 PM

View PostLeo167, on 06 May 2013 - 03:02 PM, said:

Quick question... Does the diavel come with full synthetic from the factory?


From info I have read they do not come with full synthetic, but a mineral based oil for the first 600 mile break-in. I can't confirm this information is in fact true, there is a lot of speculation as to what the original oil is. Not sure I've ever seen or heard of anyone sending their initial oil out for analysis.

#51 General Lee

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Posted 06 May 2013 - 05:24 PM

Virtually all engines come from the factory with 'break-in oil' or regular 'dino' non-synthetic oil. This is to help the rings mesh into the cylinders for the first couple thousand miles. You can dump that as early as 500 miles and switch to racing 4T full synthetic, which is what I do with all of my bikes. I tried regular full synthetic car oil in my old 955i Triumph Speed Triple and it worked okay, but not great. I wouldn't recommend it for a Ducati. You have to change oil even more frequently because it lacks some of the elements added to motorcycle-specific oils.

#52 Leo167

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Posted 06 May 2013 - 05:47 PM

View PostGiL, on 06 May 2013 - 03:29 PM, said:


From info I have read they do not come with full synthetic, but a mineral based oil for the first 600 mile break-in. I can't confirm this information is in fact true, there is a lot of speculation as to what the original oil is. Not sure I've ever seen or heard of anyone sending their initial oil out for analysis.

View PostGeneral Lee, on 06 May 2013 - 05:24 PM, said:

Virtually all engines come from the factory with 'break-in oil' or regular 'dino' non-synthetic oil. This is to help the rings mesh into the cylinders for the first couple thousand miles. You can dump that as early as 500 miles and switch to racing 4T full synthetic, which is what I do with all of my bikes. I tried regular full synthetic car oil in my old 955i Triumph Speed Triple and it worked okay, but not great. I wouldn't recommend it for a Ducati. You have to change oil even more frequently because it lacks some of the elements added to motorcycle-specific oils.


In the past, if I do decide to go synthetic or syn blend, I would usually wait till around the 2k mark
I remember my friends hyper came with syn from the factory.. Guess this stuck out in my head and didn't question it, when I read the invoice... Honestly I'm a little pissed that I wasnt asked whether to stay with Dino or plastic..I would of stuck with dino a little longer
I have no choice now but to hope that I did a good run in for that few hundred miles
But if there's no harm done, then so be it
It's just of recent with my last few bikes that I let the dealer perform the first service for the sake of documentation... I'm not liking it
Maybe more so the service writer... All I hear is yes sir. Friggin annoying

#53 TX9 Hemi

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Posted 06 May 2013 - 07:59 PM

View PostLeo167, on 06 May 2013 - 05:47 PM, said:

In the past, if I do decide to go synthetic or syn blend, I would usually wait till around the 2k mark
I remember my friends hyper came with syn from the factory.. Guess this stuck out in my head and didn't question it, when I read the invoice... Honestly I'm a little pissed that I wasnt asked whether to stay with Dino or plastic..I would of stuck with dino a little longer
I have no choice now but to hope that I did a good run in for that few hundred miles
But if there's no harm done, then so be it
It's just of recent with my last few bikes that I let the dealer perform the first service for the sake of documentation... I'm not liking it
Maybe more so the service writer... All I hear is yes sir. Friggin annoying

So true Leo just get past that first duc service with the dealer, documentation helps when it comes time for resale and factory warranty issues if any...after that basic oil changes can be done solo or by a trusted tech.

#54 DEVL-01

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Posted 06 May 2013 - 08:01 PM

I have heard some say that the diavel comes with synthetic, but i dumped my oil as soon as i got home to dino and ran it for a couple thousand klms ,and 3 more oil changes during that time before going to synthetic fwiw

Edited by DEVL-01, 06 May 2013 - 08:11 PM.


#55 albymangled

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Posted 07 May 2013 - 02:55 AM

OK here's my two bob AUD (wtf?) worth.

In my bikes I like (even though I have been told I am overdoing it) to change the oil at half the recommended mileage interval.

So every 4 thousand in my HD's, every five thou in my Speed Triple and now every six in my Ducati.

Overkill?

Probably, and my mate the mechanic says I am clogging up landfills with hardly used oil filters too.

I let the dealer do the first change then alternate with them so as to keep the service records intact.

It makes me feel good, the bike feel better and doesn't break the bank like a replacement engine would.

Guess what?

In all my bikes over many, many years I have been doing this, I have never once had an oil related engine failure.

Coincidence?

Maybe....who gives a fark?

I like my engines to be the best they can.

Once or twice we have opened one up for mechanical work and they are spotless inside.

As an aside...I asked the Duc dealer and they recommended I use the semi synth Shell not the full as it was "better for the transmission".

I used to use Mobil1 R4T in the Trump and it never complained.

I am tempted to go full synth in the Duc (Shell recommend it, go figure?)

OOps, I seem to have offered more than $0.20 AUD worth already.....

#56 bigdaddy33

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Posted 07 May 2013 - 06:14 AM

View Postalbymangled, on 07 May 2013 - 02:55 AM, said:

OK here's my two bob AUD (wtf?) worth.

In my bikes I like (even though I have been told I am overdoing it) to change the oil at half the recommended mileage interval.

So every 4 thousand in my HD's, every five thou in my Speed Triple and now every six in my Ducati.

Overkill?

Probably, and my mate the mechanic says I am clogging up landfills with hardly used oil filters too.

I let the dealer do the first change then alternate with them so as to keep the service records intact.

It makes me feel good, the bike feel better and doesn't break the bank like a replacement engine would.

Guess what?

In all my bikes over many, many years I have been doing this, I have never once had an oil related engine failure.

Coincidence?

Maybe....who gives a fark?

I like my engines to be the best they can.

Once or twice we have opened one up for mechanical work and they are spotless inside.

As an aside...I asked the Duc dealer and they recommended I use the semi synth Shell not the full as it was "better for the transmission".

I used to use Mobil1 R4T in the Trump and it never complained.

I am tempted to go full synth in the Duc (Shell recommend it, go figure?)

OOps, I seem to have offered more than $0.20 AUD worth already.....


I have a similar philosopy regarding oil change intervals. I plan on 3,000 mile intervals for the Diavel. I've done a lot of motor work on my two HD's (117" in the FXDL and 107" in the FLTRX) and change the oil every 1,000 and 2,000 miles respectively. I know it's a bit overkill, but I've never had any motor problems.

#57 Leo167

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Posted 07 May 2013 - 03:41 PM

Never had dry clutch bike,, all wet clutch
I've been doing the 3k route regardless if Dino or syn


#58 BlueToad

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Posted 30 July 2013 - 11:24 AM

Omega 3 fish oil is the best every 63 miles. Don't bother changing the filter cause the motor will not work.





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