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Oil change Intervals - Confusion???? What Oil?


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#21 tellravi

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Posted 12 October 2012 - 03:46 PM

I have been reading and I appreciate everyone's comments. There is a reason why Ducati is recommending 7500, so why do I need to do one at 3000 unless I went thru harsh riding conditions or it sat in the garage for two years. They put premium synt oil so I am guessing 7500 is good..

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#22 TurboTiger

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Posted 12 October 2012 - 05:09 PM

If you use a good quality synthetic, (mobile 1 4t is one of the good quality synthetics), you're fine at the standard 7500 mile oil change interval.

Anybody saying that the oil needs to be changed every 3,000 miles is blowing smoke. Unless you do a used oil analysis, you do not know what condition the oil is in. Just because a oil changes color does not mean it should be changed. There's a lot of myths people insist on spreading, but until you do a used oil analysis you absolutely do not know.

I am planning on changing my oil at the 7,500 mark. I'm almost at the 5k mark with no issues using the mobile 1 4t 20w50.

#23 Coop

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Posted 12 October 2012 - 08:49 PM

Sorry, I disagree with Turbo Tiger.
I don't analyze my oils, that's why I do change it more regularly than recommended. It can't hurt it changing it more often, and it might help it.
My oil has been changed at 1000klms, 5000, 9000 and 12500.
I plan on doing further ones at 18000 and then the major service at 24000. Then a oil change at least every 6000klms.
Maybe more, depending on track days etc.

:d

#24 OSOKWQ

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Posted 13 October 2012 - 10:13 AM

-I haven't seen that shell advance stuff anywhere but Europe and Japan.

- i notice a lot of the shifting problems I had with the bike went away (or are less frequent) when I went to 10w-40 ( a classic Ducati weight)

- I run my bike pretty hard, change every 5k. Using motull 300v, oil is actually pretty clean when I change it.

Edited by OSOKWQ, 13 October 2012 - 10:14 AM.


#25 Coop

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Posted 13 October 2012 - 12:24 PM

I use the Motul too.

:d

#26 DEVL-01

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Posted 13 October 2012 - 04:51 PM

No shifting problems here, Motul 5100 used in all my previous bikes so i stuck with it! i think i can beat Coops oil changes "My oil has been changed at 1000klms, 5000, 9000 and 12500." try 0 (fresh virgin mineral) ,50,500,1200 ,2500 (full synthetic) anf forgot the last one ,yes you read right! Totally agree , you can never have too many oil changes!

#27 Guest_cropduster_*

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Posted 13 October 2012 - 05:18 PM

there's a million different opinions on oil and oil change intervals so i guess i'll add mine. Worth noting that ducati used to have a much stricter service schedule than they do these days, intervals are stretched and i'm sure part of the reason is tighter tolerances in manufacture and assembly as well as better quality and higher tech tools to manufacture the parts. but, i suspect ducati have responded to criticism that their bikes are expensive to own and maintain and by stretching service intervals there's a definite reduction in costs as an owner. The warranty is two years, most owners won't rack up huge klms in 2 years so they are gambling that the bike will be out of warranty before any issues arise, now i don't know about you lot but i hold onto my bikes for a lot longer than 2 years! with that in mind the small cost of oil and filter every 5000 klms or 3000 miles is a small price to pay for peace of mind and extending the life of your engine. Oil is the life blood of your engine, cheap or wrong spec oil is not good for it but it's not as bad as old contaminated oil so for less than $100 and an hour of my time i'm happy to change my own.
I use castrol power 1 as a rule but until i've done a couple of thousand klms i use a semi synthetic rather than full synthetic.

paul.

don't be tight/cheap/frugal/scungy/ you paid a lot of cash for a ducati, respect it and change your oil regularly, yourself.

#28 rcgliderguy

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Posted 14 October 2012 - 05:57 AM

I have been a professional aviation mechanic for going on 30 years, most of that time working engines I can tell you that the right way to know when you need an oil change, based on usage, is to take an oil sample and have it analyzed. That adds an additional $60 to $80 to your first couple of oil changes while you figure out the correct change interval for you. Also most oil analysis companies know the makeup of the additive packages to branded oil and will guide you to the one that will give your machine the best protection. Most people will not use type of service due to the additional cost and trouble of taking a sample and sending it in. I have done this in the past with one of my bikes and it saved my engine from a fairly bad gasoline dilution of the oil, I found a bad needle and seat in a carb as a result and the next sample was much better. One of the best resources I have ever seen for oil information is bobistheoilguy.com.
All of our engines although built with the same parts wear differently, and when you add in different driving habits, weather and some other variables you get different wear patterns. This is where averaging oil changes comes from. 3k on dinosaur based oil is the “average” for oil changes on that type oil if used per its specification. Using car type oil in a motorcycle with a wet clutch and incorporated gear box is a no-no due to the shearing of the oil by the gear box, that is why there is motorcycle oil. It’s the additive’s to the base oil that makes the difference. Going full synthetic will result in a longer “average” most of the time. Engine manufactures have to balance cost of ownership with engine life, in this case Ducati has gone with a 7500 mile interval which is reasonable for full synthetic oil for the “average rider”. They need the engine to last 2yrs before wearing out, but they don’t want it to last forever or they will not get the additional revenue of replacement parts and new motorcycles, so if you ride hard all the time this will not suit you.
What does all this mean to you, nothing unless you want to get your oil analyzed to know for sure where you oil change interval is. Just go in changing you oil every 3k or whatever you choose and be happy. My bet is that if you use a very good synthetic oil specifically for motorcycles with incorporated gearbox and wet clutch you can do the 7500 miles with no problem unless you ride very hard all the time, then I would split it in half to 3750.
Just my .02 worth.

Edited by rcgliderguy, 14 October 2012 - 06:01 AM.


#29 ReidMcT

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Posted 14 October 2012 - 06:29 AM

For those folks doing very frequent oil changes, do you also change the other lubricants more often, such as fork oil and chassis lube points? What about air filters? Dirty air will kill an engine really fast.

I'll also remark that severe service is not just "riding hard." In fact, unless oyu are racing, riding hard isn't bad at all in oil terms. What's bad is riding in dusty conditions or making short trips. Worst is going out to the shed in the winter and running the engine for a while "to warm it up and circulate the lubricant." All that does is add moisture to the crankcase, which reacts with combustion by-products to create acids... which spend the rest of the winter eating your engine. Yes, motor oil has anti-acids, but they are exhaustable.

#30 rcgliderguy

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Posted 14 October 2012 - 07:37 AM

Quote

unless oyu are racing, riding hard isn't bad at all in oil terms


Riding hard does impact the oil, it adds to the amount of blow by and deposits in the oil and the amount of clutch material and the amount of "shear" the oil goes through in the gear box, so it does affect the oil quite a bit, but the cold weather warm up is worse for the stated reason - acid build up......all in all everything affects the oil....pick your poison antidote and run with it!

#31 INTHERED

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Posted 22 October 2012 - 08:17 AM

View Postfred, on 28 November 2011 - 05:21 PM, said:

The mechanic told me NOT to use 20w-50 because it possibly could cause clutch slippage. I buy my oil at Wal-Mart for under $10 a quart.


Your mechanic is correct but any oil not specifically marked on the label as motorcycle oil will eventually cause clutch slippage due to the different additive packages used on cars.

#32 ReidMcT

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Posted 22 October 2012 - 09:10 AM

The mechanic is not entirely right.

The key to look for is whether the oil is labeled (in the USA) as "Energy Conserving." That labeling, which can be found on the API seal on every motor oil container in the USA, indicates the presence of certain friction modifiers that are strongly associated with clutch and starter slippage.

Virtually every non-motorcycle oil with a difference of less than 30 between the low and high numbers (e.g., for 5W30 the difference is 25) is labeled as Energy Conserving and should not be used in a motorcycle with a wet clutch. Most (but not all) oils with a difference of 30 or higher are OK to use. Most 20W50 oils are not Energy Conserving, but there are a few exceptions. Read the label.

Before oil marketers discovered that motorcyclists would pay more for a motorcycle-specific oil, we all used car oil.

#33 Montducati

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Posted 22 October 2012 - 10:00 AM

View PostReidMcT, on 22 October 2012 - 09:10 AM, said:

The mechanic is not entirely right.

The key to look for is whether the oil is labeled (in the USA) as "Energy Conserving." That labeling, which can be found on the API seal on every motor oil container in the USA, indicates the presence of certain friction modifiers that are strongly associated with clutch and starter slippage.

Virtually every non-motorcycle oil with a difference of less than 30 between the low and high numbers (e.g., for 5W30 the difference is 25) is labeled as Energy Conserving and should not be used in a motorcycle with a wet clutch. Most (but not all) oils with a difference of 30 or higher are OK to use. Most 20W50 oils are not Energy Conserving, but there are a few exceptions. Read the label.

Before oil marketers discovered that motorcyclists would pay more for a motorcycle-specific oil, we all used car oil.


I've been using Mobil 1 - 10W40 full synthetic (not motorcycle specific) every 2500 miles, based on what you said I would think I'm good. I haven't experienced any clutch or starter issues to date.

I always thought if you use a quality oil and change it around 3000 miles you didn't need to purchase "motorcycle oil". I had 25K on my S4RS when I sold it, always used the recommended viscosity; however, it was Mobil 1 Synthetic car oil. The engine was as strong at 25K miles as it was at 5K miles, never had any issues with the engine.

#34 ReidMcT

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Posted 22 October 2012 - 11:51 AM

View PostMontducati, on 22 October 2012 - 10:00 AM, said:


I've been using Mobil 1 - 10W40 full synthetic (not motorcycle specific) every 2500 miles, based on what you said I would think I'm good. I haven't experienced any clutch or starter issues to date.


As far as I know, the only non-motorcycle 10W40 Mobil 1 is a High Mileage formulation. Is that what you are using, and if so, why?

#35 Montducati

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Posted 22 October 2012 - 12:01 PM

View PostReidMcT, on 22 October 2012 - 11:51 AM, said:


As far as I know, the only non-motorcycle 10W40 Mobil 1 is a High Mileage formulation. Is that what you are using, and if so, why?


Why not? This oil is safe for older and new engines (see below) plus it is the recommended Ducati viscosity.

Ask Mobil Posted Image Posted Image Posted Image Posted Image Using Mobil 1 High Mileage 10W-40 in a Low-Mileage Motorcycle

Ask Your Stickiest Question. . . Or ask us something you’ve always wanted to know about using our products. We’ll sort through all the submissions and present the best questions to our automotive experts. We'll share the questions and their answers here.
Posted Image Posted Image Question: Using Mobil 1 High Mileage 10W-40 in a Low-Mileage Motorcycle I own a 2005 Suzuki GSX1300R Hayabusa motorcycle that calls for a 10W-40 oil. The Mobil 1 at this viscosity reads, "For high mileage vehicles" on the bottle. My bike only has 400 miles. Is this of any importance or is this good to use for any mileage vehicle? -- Carl Gustafson, Rehoboth, MA Posted Image Answer: Mobil 1 High Mileage oils can be used in both newer and older vehicles. In newer vehicles, some of the performance additives included for older vehicles will not be needed but they will not cause any problem in newer vehicles. The product you should use in your bike is Mobil 1 Racing 4T 10W-40 specifically designed for motorcycle engines and transmissions.

Of course Mobil recommends the Mobil 1 Racing 4T 10w-40; however, IMO if you're changing the oil 2500-3000 it's a waste of money. If I were going 5000-7000 miles between oil changes I would use the 4T.

Edited by Montducati, 22 October 2012 - 12:09 PM.


#36 Guest_cropduster_*

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Posted 22 October 2012 - 02:00 PM

Reid is spot on! the API "energy conserving" oil is necessary for cars as they require it to meet the strict emissions requirements, the friction modifiers in it will kill a wet clutch in no time and should not be used on a bike. motorcycle specific oils also have a higher shear strength to help with life in the gearbox seeing as most bikes share oil between engine and box.

#37 Sonic Duck

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Posted 22 October 2012 - 07:01 PM

http://www.shell.com...la/products/t6/

:thumbup

#38 ReidMcT

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Posted 23 October 2012 - 06:11 AM

Yep. When I switch to synthetic at my next change, I'll be using Rotella T.

#39 TurboTiger

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Posted 23 October 2012 - 01:07 PM

The correct oil certification for a motorcycle with a wet clutch is JASO MA certified.
http://www.oilspecif..._MA_JASO_MB.php

Shell Rotella T6 is a awesome fully synthetic oil that's also JASO MA certified, and quite inexpensive when compared to other fully synthetic oil.

#40 fred

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Posted 24 October 2012 - 04:38 PM

My friend has been a high end boat racer ( Valley Field) and he turned me on to Mobil One years ago. A quality synthetic MC oil with a quality oil filter should easily protect the Diavel engine for 5k plus miles. I for piece of mind have been changing the oil in all my bikes every 5k miles. I used to go every 4k but I have changed.





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